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Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
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Author:  MasonTheChef [ Thu Oct 10, 2013 10:45 am ]
Post subject:  Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
So now that new moves, abilities, items, and pokemon are being reveled en mass and the meta has a few weeks until all the new mechanics are processed and set. What pokes/movesets are you hoping to use on your first XY meta teams?

I'm looking at this TankTop

Hitmontop
Adamant @ Intimidate
Assault Vest
248HP 252Atk 8Spd
-Power-up Punch
-Sucker Punch
-Close Combat/HJK
-Stone Edge
Author:  Kiga [ Thu Oct 10, 2013 1:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
So something like this?

Gengar @ Gengarite
Nature: Timid
Ability: Levitate (/Shadow Tag)
EVs: 0/0/4/252/0/252
-Shadow Ball
-[Moon Blast]/Thunderbolt/Thunder
-Focus Blast
-Substitute/Explosion

Would it be remiss to plan to have two options for a Mega Pokemon on a competitive team? This would allow for a more adaptable strategy, and allow you to possibly mislead your opponent, although at the cost of item for at least one of your pokemon. Now, I'll admit that I've never used Gengar before, but I wrote this strategy in mind so that Gengar could be useable with this set in mind, so that Gengar can have an option outside of needing to evolve.

Gengar-M, with its speed and attack, combined with Shadow Tag, has the potential to be the best revenge killer that I've ever seen. Given it's massive attack, I felt it would benefit more from the Timid speed boost. Shadow Ball provides a STAB attack, and hits Steel types now. I don't know if Gengar will learn Moon Blast, but if it does, it will hit Dark types which could cause issue, particularly with Pursuit, and it will hit Dragons for more damage than HP Ice (I have not considered double weaknesses yet, however). Thunderbolt is an option if Moon Blast is not available, and Thunder can be used on a rain team, although you will need to be wary of your timing, now. Focus Blast provides some coverage, although I believe it's primary use on Gengar in Gen V was to hit Steel-types, which is not as big of an issue here in Gen VI, so it might be better to replace with something that has a more reliable accuracy. At least full neutral damage is covered between Ghost, Fighting, and either Fairy and Electric, and a super-effective coverage against nine types.

Substitute can be used for the event that you use another Mega Pokemon, although you will lack any recovery. Unfortunately, with max IV's, Gengar-M's Hp is divisible by four, so I redirected the EVs into Defense instead. On the other hand, Hp EVs may be used with Explosion, which will hit most things hard.

Ferrothorn would be a very good team mate for Gengar-M, as it can tank the physical blows that Gengar-M cannot, and Gengar-M is immune to the Fighting moves that still hurt Ferrothorn. Also, Ferrothorn can provide Stealth Rock, which will only help Gengar-M's purpose, and Gengar-M can trap victims of Leech Seed, which will provide an artificial recovery boost, which helps the Substitute strategy. Ferrothorn also benefits from rain, which reduces it's primary weakness, so Politoed is also a good team member. A good physical counter-part will be needed to cover Blissey, who walls Gengar-M; as far as I can tell, she takes less than 50% damage from Explosion, is immune to Shadow Ball, and even after weakness is accounted for, Focus Blast is still weaker than Explosion.

I'll stop here, as it's too early to fully plan this out.
Author:  MasonTheChef [ Fri Oct 18, 2013 12:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
Power-up Punch YOU HAD ONE JOB GAMEFREAK!!!!!
Author:  GofD [ Fri Oct 18, 2013 2:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
MasonTheChef wrote:
Power-up Punch YOU HAD ONE JOB GAMEFREAK!!!!!


Im gonna take a wild guess and say......Hitmontop no learn Power-up Punch?

Anyways, I have a set for Chesnaught that I am more than likely gonna do. (if all goes well)

Chesnaught

Adamant
252HP/252 Att/ 4 Spd
BulletProof

Item-???

Bulk up
Drain Punch (possibly, still waiting on an "official" word, mostly unconfirmed that he can learn this)
Hammer Arm
Stone Edge

Chesnaught......is pretty much a tank. Bullet Proof makes him even tankier. Im gonna go with Adamant for more Oomph. Max Iv's in Att and HP. I did Max Hp, mainly cause of Hammer Arm's Recoil. Drain Punch is to counter the recoil from Hammer Arm, and is a second stab. If Chesnaught CAN'T learn Drain Punch, Im gonna need something different, cause the recoil of Hammer arm is pretty big. Bulk up.....Dont think I really need to explain that one. Stone Edge is 100% percent needed covering 3 of This guys weaknesses (Flying, Fire, Ice). Im still trying to decide what item, since I have yet to see any of the new hold items, Bar mega stones.
Author:  Dare234 [ Sat Oct 19, 2013 9:17 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
I'm considering doing a fast, physical Greninja set.

Greninja
Jolly @ Torrent/Protean
Flying Gem/Razor Fang
4Hp/252Atk/252spd

-Power-Up Punch
-Water Shuriken/Waterfall
-Night Slash
-Acrobatics/U-Turn

Protean would be a possiblity over Torrent; it allows Greninja to change to the type of move that it is going to use. This would give it STAB on every move at the cost of becoming a pure type for the duration of the turn (e.g. Greninja would be pure Fighting type if it used Power-Up Punch). This also means that you would have to adapt to fluxuating weaknesses and resistances.

Flying Gem would allow Greninja to hit more effectively with Acrobatics while Razor Fang would give Water Shuriken a decent chance at flinching the opponent.

EVs and Nature to maximize speed and attack. This would essentially be a glass cannon/revenge killer, especially considering its less than stellar defenses.

Power-Up Punch for Fighting coverage along with an attack boost.
Water Shuriken for STAB priority. It really needs a Power-Up Punch boost to be decent if it doesn't hit 4-5 times. Waterfall could be used for more reliable power if priority isn't a concern.
Night Slash for Dark STAB.
With Acrobatics, you get SE coverage on everything but Water, Electric, Poison, Flying, Dargon, and Fairy.
With U-Turn, you get SE coverage on everything but all the ones listed above plus Fighting and Bug, while being able to switch out if needed.

I'll probably end up using Acrobatics just to cover Fighting and Bug. Either way Greninja will struggle against Electric and Fairy types.
Author:  ChillBill [ Sat Oct 19, 2013 10:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
Greninja is best if it goes Special. Also, no matter what, use Protean. It's great if you can utilize it.

So here's mine:

Aegislash w/Stance Change @Life Orb
Adamant Nature-252 Atk/252 HP
Sacred Sword
Shadow Sneak
Swords Dance
King's Shield

The set which is theorized to be the most popular with Aegislash. By changing between offensive and defensive stance and utilizing the very high stats it gets in both of them, Aegislash can power up itself, eliminate opponents with Sacred Sword and Shadow Sneak, and then change back to safety with King's Shield, often taking down the enemy's Attack in the process.
Author:  GofD [ Sat Oct 19, 2013 12:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
@ ChillBill

That set....I really like it, although Im not sure I like only have 2 attacks on a Offensive Poke, But then again, Aegislash isnt exactly a regular Offesive Poke with Stance change and his Unique move.

As for my Chesnaught Set, Drain Punch is starting to look like its not part of his Move pool.... So I might have to go with something like......

Seedbomb/Needle arm
Bulk up/Power up Punch
Low sweep/Hammer Arm
Stone Edge

Seedbomb over Wood hammer due to wood Hammers Recoil. Bulk up or Power- up Punch. I personally would likely use Bulk up With Hammer Arm, Since Hammer Arm Does Lower his speed. Low Sweep to lower the opponents speed, letting Chesnaught get in more hits,and also makes Needle arm more viable with its Flinch chance. Stone Edge is there for again, Coverage over 3 of his 4 weaknesses, and is really a NON-NEGOTIABLE move.
Author:  ChillBill [ Sat Oct 19, 2013 9:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
GofD wrote:
That set....I really like it, although Im not sure I like only have 2 attacks on a Offensive Poke, But then again, Aegislash isnt exactly a regular Offesive Poke with Stance change and his Unique move.


Admittedly, the idea isn't mine. That's the set being discussed the most in Smogon right now. Some also consider Iron Head, but really I think that's the best set.
Author:  Dare234 [ Sun Oct 20, 2013 6:26 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
ChillBill wrote:
Greninja is best if it goes Special. Also, no matter what, use Protean. It's great if you can utilize it.


I've been considering doing a special set, but I'm a sucker for physical sets. And besides, it'll be a nice little surprise for people expecting a special set. :P I can always train a special one later as well.

I would use Protean and will once I get my hands on it. But for now, Torrent will do.
Author:  MasonTheChef [ Mon Oct 21, 2013 3:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
Dare234 wrote:
I would use Protean and will once I get my hands on it. But for now, Torrent will do.


Trade me if you happen to see me in-game online. I got a ton of em.

Here's the Greninja set I'm using
Timid @ Protean
Expert belt/Life orb
4 HP/252 S.atk./252 Spd
Surf
Ice beam
Hidden Power Ghost
Grass knot
Author:  ChillBill [ Mon Oct 21, 2013 4:08 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
That's one of the best Greninja sets I've seen so far. Hidden Power Ghost is for spinblocking, right? Have you tried to use a Dark move?
Author:  MasonTheChef [ Mon Oct 21, 2013 8:56 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
ChillBill wrote:
That's one of the best Greninja sets I've seen so far. Hidden Power Ghost is for spinblocking, right? Have you tried to use a Dark move?


It's to attack and laugh at any Bug/Fighting poke that hopes to hit me SE in return, Grass knot does the same for Electric/Grass.
Author:  Dare234 [ Mon Oct 21, 2013 4:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
MasonTheChef wrote:
Dare234 wrote:
I would use Protean and will once I get my hands on it. But for now, Torrent will do.


Trade me if you happen to see me in-game online. I got a ton of em.


I actually just acquired a Protean Frogadier. Thanks for the offer though!
Author:  NastyNati311 [ Wed Oct 23, 2013 10:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
I'll post a couple sets I found that I'm working on right now for competitive use.
Goodra
Nature: Modest
Ability: Gooey
Item: Assault Vest
Moves:
- Draco Meteor
- Fire Blast
- Thunderbolt
- Focus Blast
EV Spread: 248 HP / 252 Sp Atk / 8 Def

Greninja
Nature: Hasty
Ability: Protean
Item: Focus Sash
Moves:
- Spikes
- Ice Beam
- Hydro Pump
- U-Turn
EV Spread: 252 Speed / 252 Sp Atk /4 Atk
Author:  ChillBill [ Thu Oct 24, 2013 5:16 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
Here's another one for a new Pokemon

Clawitzer w/ Mega Launcher @ Leftovers/Life Orb
Modest Nature-252HP, 252SpA, 4Spe
Water Pulse
Aura Sphere
Dark Pulse/Sludge Bomb
Ice Beam/Dragon Pulse

While Clawitzer isn't exactly great, it's fun to use and I like it a lot... This set isn't meant for sweeping, but it can still break some teeth.
Author:  MasonTheChef [ Sat Oct 26, 2013 6:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
Set I bred for wifi;

Bronzong
Relaxed
Heatproof @ Weakness policy/life orb
252HP 132Atk 90Def 30S.def
-Trick room
-Rock slide
-Gyro ball
-Earthquake

This was made namely to counter all the fast heavy offence pokes running around wifi. Blaziken, Mewtwo, Xerneas, Lucario, Talonflame, Heilolisk

He's capable of surviving any of their onslaughts, if lucky a fire/non-STAB ghost/dark move will activate weakness policy, then set up TR and sweep or simply revenge kill.

Also a great way of turning sticky web around on the opponent :p
Author:  ChillBill [ Sat Oct 26, 2013 9:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
Hmm... Bronzong's offenses are still quite pathetic, so I don't know what it can do even at +2. Gyro Ball is its best shot I guess. However, keep in mind to have some other slow Pokes before you set up Trick Room.
Oh, and since a point is added every 4EVs (or at least used to be), don't go for 90/30, they aren't divided by 4. Go for 92/28 or 88/32.
Author:  MasonTheChef [ Sun Oct 27, 2013 5:24 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
+2 132 Atk Bronzong Gyro Ball (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mewtwo: 366-432 (103.68 - 122.37%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 132 Atk Bronzong Earthquake vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Blaziken: 402-474 (133.11 - 156.95%) -- guaranteed OHKO (18% OHKO w/LO)
+2 132 Atk Bronzong Gyro Ball (129 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Xerneas: 788-928 (172.8 - 203.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO (12% OHKO w/LO)
+2 132 Atk Bronzong Earthquake vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Lucario: 402-474 (142.55 - 168.08%) -- guaranteed OHKO (56% OHKO w/LO)
132 Atk Bronzong Rock Slide vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Talonflame: 296-352 (99.66 - 118.51%) -- 93.75% chance to OHKO (100% OHKO w/either)
132 Atk Bronzong Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Heilolisk: 252-298 (95.09 - 112.45%) -- 68.75% chance to OHKO (100%w/either)

Being Wifi I can also assume hp/def IVs are a bit less, but not always.

As for the EVs I can't believe I derped that.... I should stop breeding a midnight, RESET BAG GO!

As for aliies it has Ammonguss, Rotom-H, Azumarrill, Hitmontop all not terribly slow but can make use of TR against most teams.
Author:  ChillBill [ Sun Oct 27, 2013 10:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
Well, that seems kinda good then. I'm not prepared for TR anyway, so don't expect me to accept a battle :P . Unless you can find me a flawless Ditto first.

Anyway, I was looking into Xerneas recently, and I was wondering what could a potent moveset be. Here's an idea for a Special set.

Xerneas w/Fairy Aura @ Power Herb
Modest Nature-4HP, 252Att, 252Spe
Geomancy
Moonblast
Thunder Bolt
Psychic/Focus Blast

I'm not quite sure... Didn't have the chance to check its entire movepool, and I don't like Xerneas anyway, but I felt it was gonna be a big threat in Ubers with that type and Geomancy, so I figured I'd check it, since Ubers is my primary tier.
Author:  MasonTheChef [ Tue Oct 29, 2013 5:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
Current Breeding project, used it a bit in Pokebank OU and worked quite well as a cleric.

Florges
Calm 252 HP/252 Def/4 Spd
Flower Veil @ Leftovers
-Wish
-Protect
-Moonblast
-Aromatherapy
Author:  Kiga [ Tue Oct 29, 2013 6:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
I've been breeding a ralts to use in the Maison:

Gardevoir @ Gardevoirite
Timid (Spd+,Atk-) | Trace
4 HP/252 SAtk/252 Spd
-Echoed Voice/Moon Blast
-Psyshock
-Focus Blast/Shadow Ball
-Calm Mind

I plan to pair her with a Leech Seed Ferrothorn to cover her defensively. I have not tested Echoed Voice yet, but I'm hoping it will work. Hyper Voice would be ideal, but...
Author:  ChillBill [ Wed Oct 30, 2013 4:41 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
OK, I guess you like the Ralts line, but really, I don't think using Mega Gardevoir is a good idea. If you wanna use it that badly, I suggest picking Moonblast over Echoed Voice. And don't use Focus Blast. Its primary purpose was to defeat Dark types, and with that weakness eliminated plus STAB Moonblast, I don't think you need it. Go for either Shadow Ball or ThunderBolt. Plus, Gardevoir is slow so I don't know how viable a Timid nature with Speed EVs is... I'd see it more like a bulky CM set. You might want to look into that.
Author:  MasonTheChef [ Wed Oct 30, 2013 4:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
MegaGardevior is 100 base speed so maxing it does put it quite ahead of a good amount of mons.

I think Echoed voice/Hyper Voice is just to make use of pixialate. But Moonblast is better in singles, in doubles Hyper Voice is good to strike through Protect.
Author:  Kiga [ Wed Oct 30, 2013 5:35 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
I don't really have time to fully explain my set now, but Hyper Voice is indeed better than Moon Blast even in singles, as long as M-Gardevoir uses it. Pixilate, Aerilate, and Refridgerate automatically boost normal moves by 1.3 percent when they change them, so Mega Gardevoir is looking at a 117 base power before stab in Hyper Voice, that is capable of moving beyond substitute. This is the niche that Smogon seems to be finding for her.
Author:  ChillBill [ Wed Oct 30, 2013 7:15 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Theorymoning sets for the XY meta.
Pixilate gives a boost? I didn't know that. I guess this does make Hyper Voice viable (still not Echoed). Still, the idea of filling your Mega slot with Gardevoir isn't one that appeals to me. Gardevoir seems a bit... underwhelming. Then again, it's your choice. After all, what we discuss here are sets.
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